11 10 108 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/546a63c8e2b15c01ed9368ba65414235.jpg b1af44de28d04fea6a20a603b2c29dd3 Physical Object An inanimate, three-dimensional object or substance. Note that digital representations of, or surrogates for, these objects should use Moving Image, Still Image, Text or one of the other types. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource St. Joseph’s Free School and The Academy of Mount Saint Vincent, stained glass panels, 1810; 1859; 1943; 1972 Subject The topic of the resource Catholic schools St. Joseph’s Academy (Emmitsburg, Md.) McGowan’s Pass (Convent: New York, N.Y) Academy of Mount St. Vincent on-the-Hudson (New York, N.Y.) Academy of Mount St. Vincent (Tuxedo Park, N.Y.) Central Park (New York, N.Y.) –Pictorial works Bronx (New York, N.Y.) – Pictorial works Schools –New York (State) –Tuxedo Park – Pictorial works Schools – New York (City) – Bronx –Pictorial works Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Peter Appleton, Artist A handwritten note recorded by Sr. Maria Lawrence Keating, who taught at the Academy of Mount Saint Vincent, Tuxedo Park, from 1948-1966, states that Mother Mary Fuller asked artist Peter Appleton, who designed the windows for the Tuxedo Park chapel to create these plaques to honor the tradition of the Academy. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1859; 1947 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource stained glass Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Physical Object Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1810; 1847; 1859; 1943 St. Joseph’s Academy (Emmitsburg, Md.) McGowan’s Pass (Convent: New York, N.Y) Academy of Mount St. Vincent on-the-Hudson (New York, N.Y.) Academy of Mount St. Vincent (Tuxedo Park, N.Y.) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Permission for reproduction or quotation must be obtained through written application to: Director of Archives, Sisters of Charity of New York, 6301 Riverdale Avenue, Bronx, New York, 10471. This permission is valid only insofar as he Archives of the Sisters of Charity of New York, as owner or custodian, has any rights in the matter and does not remove the responsibility of the author, editor, and publisher to guard against the infringement of any rights; including copyright, that may be held by others. Description An account of the resource Panel 1, upper section: Emmitsburg, Maryland, 1810: In 1810 when Elizabeth Seton arrived in Emmitsburg, Maryland, the new community of the Sisters of Charity of Saint Joseph’s, opened a free school, the two-story Federal-style building depicted, today known as the ‘White House.’ On February 22, 1810, three girls were the first day students to attend Saint Joseph’s Free School, the first free Catholic school for girls staffed by religious women in the country. Panel 1, lower section: McGown’s Pass, Manhattan, 1847: Mother Seton’s school in Emmitsburg was the precursor to the Academy of Mount Saint Vincent, Bronx, opened after the New York Sisters separated from Emmitsburg community in 1847. Under the patronage of Reverend John Hughes, the first Archbishop of New York and brother to Mother Mary Angela Hughes who led the Community 1855-1861, the Academy at McGown’s Pass was regarded as one of the pioneer institutions in the East for the education of Catholic girls. In 1851, the Academy received its charter from the New York State Legislature. McGown’s Pass at approximately 109th Street and 5th Avenue, had been the location of Revolutionary War headquarters for George Washington and his army. Panel 2, upper section: Font Hill-On-Hudson, Bronx, New York, 1859 When the Sisters were asked to vacate the McGown’s Pass property in Manhattan for the planned development of Central Park, they purchased the 55-acre estate Font Hill-On-Hudson located on the east bank of the Hudson River. In 1859 when construction of the first building at Font Hill-on-Hudson was completed, the building included accommodations for the new Academy and boarding students. The classrooms, grand study hall, art room, music hall, reception rooms, as well as the Convent and Chapel of the Immaculate Conception were housed in this building, today known as Founders Hall. Panel 2, lower section: Tuxedo Park, New York, 1943 As the College student population increased, the need for separate quarters for the Academy’s faculty, students, and activities, was addressed. To provide a new location for the school, Archbishop Spellman deeded an estate in Tuxedo Park, New York, that had been donated to the Archdiocese of New York by Mrs. E. John Heidseick. On this property, the mansion ‘Chastellux’ first housed the Academy of Mount Saint Vincent at Tuxedo Park in 1943. In 1947, the Academy expanded in acreage when Mr. Erasmus Lindley deeded his adjacent home and property. Relation A related resource Panel 1; Panel 2 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/f5772acb53d4b44e8a7e639985c72c57.jpg 7d69fb44d20742e557a10893d637261b Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource St. Vincent de Paul Medal Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Sisters of Charity of the Immaculate Conception, St. John, New Brunswick Relation A related resource N/A Type The nature or genre of the resource Physical Object Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context N/A Subject The topic of the resource Commemorative medals St. Vincent de Paul Sisters of Charity of the Immaculate Conception, St. John, New Brunswick Description An account of the resource Worn from 1854 - 1967, the St. Vincent de Paul medal was attached to the 15 decade rosary, worn at the sisters' left side. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Unknown Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1854-1967 Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource N/A Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Permission for any type of publication of archival materials, including text, photographs, video, or audio must be secured from the Sisters of Charity of the Immaculate Conception, St. John, New Brunswick. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource metal Language A language of the resource English https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/cdd6aad9b13f3d870fd1f1a86233ad57.jpg 7a07f58964579cb409b458433eff3ef5 Physical Object An inanimate, three-dimensional object or substance. Note that digital representations of, or surrogates for, these objects should use Moving Image, Still Image, Text or one of the other types. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Status of Mary as the Incomparable Virgin Subject The topic of the resource Mary, Blessed Virgin, Saint Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Unknown Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived N/A Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available N/A Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource ca. Relation A related resource N/A Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Physical object Description An account of the resource The statue of Mary as the Incomparable Virgin. The Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth actually began as the Sisters of Charity in Nashville, TN. When their situation there changed leaving them in financial straits the Community’s foundress, Mother Xavier Ross, left to attend a meeting of Bishops in St. Louis, MO. In hopes of finding a Bishop who needed their work. Before leaving, Mother Xavier instructed the Sisters to begin a Novena to Mary as the Incomparable Virgin that she be successful. In St. Louis Mother Xavier met Bishop Miege, Bishop of the territory East of the Rocky Mountains and headquartered in Leavenworth, KS. Bishop Miege was pleased to have the Sisters come settle and minister to the people of Kansas. Mother Xavier returned to Nashville with the good news and the Sisters have ever since held Mary, the Incomparable Virgin in regard as well as the Novena. Unfortunately, in order to settle their debts before leaving Nashville the Sisters had to sell off most of their furniture and all of their land and buildings and so did not bring much with them to Leavenworth. One of the few things they did bring was this statue of the Incomparable Virgin. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The material in this collection is made available by the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth. To request reproductions or to inquire about permissions, contact SCL Archives at 913-758-6588, or tcrawford@scls.org. Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/04acbd862e63b60537f3d4a472cbdfd1.jpg 77f386689d45b931210d7f7781695801 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/addf53381c342a9828ebaee3717752c5.jpg 06c4d89f0e47b7c2f1ba98f5b01caa3f https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/597c94dc9568552cafe18f37838c80dc.jpg a49ee1f405ea7c1acd7d39936f3d2cb9 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Steeple from former Bethany Motherhouse Chapel, crowning a reflective pool in the Bethany Centennial Gardens Subject The topic of the resource Architecture Bell tower Buildings Fountain Nova Scotia -- Antigonish County Spire Steeple and steeple components Description An account of the resource Built from 1962 to 1963, the steeple stood atop the Sisters of St. Martha’s Motherhouse Chapel for more than 50 years, sheltering the bell and serving as a hillside symbol of hope. Its construction, paired with a new chapel and wing, marked a period of immense growth in the size of the congregation. Composed of a steel frame and clad in copper, the steeple is topped with a stainless-steel crucifix. This crucifix was a modern addition, replacing the original gold-leaf cross that was damaged during a storm in 2005. When the Motherhouse was deconstructed, from 2018 to 2019, the remaining grounds were transformed into the Bethany Centennial Gardens. The steeple was then installed amid the garden. Refurbished, it now surmounts a granite and concrete reflective pool, and rests upon a weathered-steel base, bearing the inscriptions of the Congregation of the Sisters of St. Martha’s “CSM” symbol, and a quotation from previous Chapters’ Directional Statements, “standing together in undaunted hope”. Still skimming the hillside, the steeple provides a peaceful place for contemplation and continues to be a visible symbol of the Marthas’ presence and faith. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Patrick Keenleyside Architect from the firm Govan Kaminker Langley Keenleyside Melick Devonshire & Wilson Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Congregation of the Sisters of St. Martha, Antigonish Nova Scotia. Photographs provided by CSM Communications Coordinator and CSM Archives. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Congregation of the Sisters of St. Martha, Antigonish Nova Scotia. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1962-1963, original construction 2020-2022, installation at Bethany Centennial Garden Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Online access is provided for research purposes only. Permission for reproduction or use requests must be obtained. Please contact: CSM Archives, Congregation of the Sisters of St. Martha, 75 Marian Drive, Antigonish, Nova Scotia, Canada, B2G 2G6. This permission is valid only insofar as CSM Archives, as owner or custodian, has any rights in the matter and does not remove the responsibility of the author, editor, and publisher to guard against the infringement of any rights, including copyright, that may be held by others. Relation A related resource N/A Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Copper, steel, weathered-steel, granite, and cement Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Physical Object Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context N/A Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1962-2022 Antigonish, Nova Scotia, Canada Coordinates: Lat: 45 39 00 N degrees minutes Lat: 45.6500 decimal degrees Long: 062 00 00 W degrees minutes Long: -62.0000 decimal degrees Sisters of St. Martha of Antigonish https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/e7d423746b612934b6aa582f39932577.PNG 9895188b913e1d60f14980bd7099b7ff https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/d348782f0051d1a23f181dbdeee554c7.mp3 a5d25f8c889aa6d2509bfbd7cdc120c0 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/f143babda00908c8121b6097b57d12bb.pdf 87d7bce1fd042e19e1202c7079825691 PDF Text Text Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 1 of 19 JK: This interview is with Sister Mary Denise Sternizke. The interviewer is Jane Kenamore, and we are at the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Mother House in Leavenworth, Kansas. The date is June 28th, 2017. Sister Mary Denise, I love that name, by the way. It's beautiful. Sister Mary Denise, when and where were you born? [00:00:26] MDS: I was born in 1922 in Sedalia, Missouri. JK: Oh, ok. Can you tell us about your parents and how they influenced you over the years? [00:39:00] MDS: My dad, Leo Sternizke, worked in the offices of the MKT or Katy Railroad, and I think my mother must have been doing secretarial work or something, but that's where they met. And my dad was an ardent Catholic. Mother is a convert, but she was a good convert. I mean she really converted. And after one year, because when the Katy offices moved we moved too. So, we moved to Boonville, Missouri, were there for about eight years. And then they moved the offices to Parsons, Kansas, so we moved to Parsons, Kansas, and that's where I lived for the eight years before I entered the Sisters of Charity. JK: And did you enter the Sisters of Charity right out of high school? [00:01:36] MDS: Yes, I did. JK: You did. MDS: Yes. JK: And what attracted you to religious life? [00:01:42] MDS: I think my vocation to religious life started three days after I was born. My father took me to be baptized. He wasn't taking any chances. He's going to have his daughter baptized right away, and in those days you didn't have a big ceremony. I mean it was just the sponsors. And when the sponsors had left my dad picked me up, took me over the Blessed Mother's alter and offered me to her. JK: Really. MDS: That was a pretty big thing. I never knew that until the day I said, "Dad, I want to be a Sister." And then he told me that. JK: Oh, my goodness. That is very interesting. [00:02:27] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 2 of 19 MDS: And I know that he was the happiest person on earth at that point. My mother didn't take it quite so (laughs)… quite so calmly, but, you know, it evolved and got better and better, our relationship and finally she was actually happy that I did that. JK: Oh, good. Good. How long did it take your mom to accept your entering the SCL community? [00:02:59] MDS: Well, she came up with me to visit, to see the place and see if that's what I really wanted, and she was very good about it. And, you know, as the community evolved ,that is, in changing habits and all that, she liked that and there was a lot more freedom and getting to go visit them. So, by the time we had gotten pretty close to the end of our lives, why, she was very happy that I had done it. JK: Oh, good. That's good. Like many other new members of the community you spent your early years teaching in grade school and elementary school. MDS: Yes. JK: So, first you taught in the lower grades, is that right? [00:03:53] MDS: Yes, I did. I started out in the third. Then I had first and second, and then went onto to the sixth to eighth (phonetic) group. JK: And how many years were involved in that? [00:04:06] MDS: It was about six years, you know. JK: Oh, ok. Ok. And, let's see, you went to Denver? [00:04:16] MDS: Those are all correct. My elementary… there was Denver, and St. Mary's is right but not Topeka and Billings. JK: Oh, ok. MDS: Those were high school. JK: Oh, those were high school. Ok. How were your experiences…? Since you had never taught before how did you deal with this? [00:04:36] MDS: Teaching was not my choice. I wanted medical technology. JK: Oh, you did. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 3 of 19 MDS: I did very much. But in the community you do what the community needs, you know. And I had never been around children of that age. I mean I had no particular rapport with them. All I had was one brother and he was just three years younger, and we didn't babysit in those days. And I can say I did not like teaching in the elementary. I mean I just didn't feel comfortable with people that age. It was a whole different story when I got with teenagers. JK: Oh, was it? [00:05:22] MDS: Oh, yes. Loved them; loved them. JK: Oh, good. So, then you did go on and teach in high school, and where did you teach there? [00:05:33] MDS: I taught in all of our high schools except about three. My longest stretch was in Topeka, but I also taught in all three of the Kansas Cities—Missouri, Kansas, and North Kansas City— and Falls City, Nebraska, Billings, Montana, Denver. JK: Where was your favorite place to teach? [00:06:01] MDS: I think St. Pius X in North Kansas City. JK: Oh, really? MDS: I think so. JK: And what did you like about that? [00:06:07] MDS: The students were students for one thing. I mean it was very academically oriented. And there was no such thing as any problem with discipline. Their parents were behind them and they were good students. In my sophomore class the top 20, if you can believe it, academically were boys except for one girl. JK: Really. MDS: That's unusual. I mean girls at those ages usually outshine the boys. JK: Right. What were you teaching at that time? [00:06:48] MDS: Different levels of mathematics—one, two, three and four—and chemistry. JK: Upper math… MDS: Yes. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 4 of 19 JK: …was more boy oriented at that time. MDS: That's what they say, but, you know, in one school where I had too large a class for a fourth year math we had four rows of boys and one whole row of girls. JK: Did you? MDS: Yes. When they're good they're very good. JK: That's good. So, you were saying earlier that teaching math has changed drastically over the years. Can you tell a little bit about that? [00:07:32] MDS: Can I just lump the math and chemistry together because the same things have happened. In the span of time that I was teaching those courses the subject matter and the method of teaching changed radically, probably more in chemistry than in math. But people don't realize that mathematics research is going on at a great rate at the same time. It starts at the universities and then trickles down. And the people teaching are going to have to change with it and that means continual education. And I was very lucky in math. The community sent me to Notre Dame as soon as I got my bachelor's degree and I spent the summers there, taught in the winters. And I got my master's in mathematics in the summer of 1955, I think it was, and then continued teaching in the high schools. And as far as chemistry is concerned it changed even more radically and it required even more preparation on the part of teachers. And the thing was that the college chemistry teachers were saying that high school students are not prepared for college chemistry. So, that meant the high school chemistry had to be revised and really revised from being descriptive chemistry to theoretical chemistry, and that's harder for both the teacher and the student. JK: And can you define descriptive chemistry and theoretical? [00:09:25] MDS: Kind of. If I said to you today we will study sulfur. Sulfur is yellow. Things like that that describe the element, not so much what they do. And then the theoretical part was based almost, not entirely, but more on energy and energy changes and it was more difficult. And so the teachers really had to go back to school, and we would be getting things in the summertime. Well, my master's degree from Notre Dame gave me a big head start on the mathematics, although I did take some other courses later. But the National Science Foundation came to the rescue and offered a large number of summer fellowships in the sciences. And what you had to do is to apply for one and if you got it then you had a free ride for that summer to study. I had �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 5 of 19 one in physics at Seattle U. I had one in chemistry at St. Louis University. I had one in math at Brown University and another one at Notre Dame one time. JK: Oh, my gosh. MDS: So, by that time I had a much better science background although I still took some work later on. And teachers just had to do that if they were going to present the material that was in text books. JK: Right. And when was this big change? I mean I'm sure it was over several years but when was the…? [00:11:11] MDS: Yes it did. It evolved. It evolved. JK: What was that time period? [00:11:15] MDS: I got my master's degree in '55, 1955. The years following that, and it wasn't just one year, I mean. It was a continual thing. And every summer or before the summer the National Science Foundation would print a booklet of what was being offered, and then you could pick out what you needed and apply for that, and if you got it, that was it. You went. JK: That's great. That was kind of post-Sputnik, so there was a lot of emphasis on science and math during that period. [00:11:54] MDS: Yes, yes, because it was changing so much, I think. JK: So, overall, did you teach in a girl's school too? [00:12:06] MDS: No. JK: So you always… MDS: One year when I taught, when we still had an academy here, and that was all girls, I taught one chemistry class there. JK: Oh, just one. [00:12:17] MDS: Yes. Because I was studying at the same time. JK: Oh, ok. So, that wasn't a very sizable experience but how did the girls in the all girls environment do as opposed to the girls in the co-ed environment? [00:12:38] MDS: Well, I think people think they're supposed to… �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 6 of 19 JK: Right. MDS: …because the boys seem to take dominance in those subjects. But one of my challenges, and one that I was really dedicated to, was to get more girls into the field, to really like and want to go on in mathematics. And it was a real reward for me to get someone who was scared to death to take a math course to get over that. I even met that at the college. They had one math course required and there were people who left it to their senior year hoping it would evaporate or something. And that was a great reward for me to be able to get them over that hump of feeling that way. And I understood it because when I was in high school my lowest grades were in math until my senior year. JK: Oh, really. [00:13:45] MDS: I just kept taking it to keep my dad happy because he's the one that really taught me to think. And if it hadn't been for that I might never have made the master's degree in mathematics. But I never could just get the answer. I had to know why. And that really helped me. So, I could transfer that to other girls, you know, to try to make them see that they could be just as good in math as boys. And we really came out with some good ones. JK: Oh, that's good. And what about your love of chemistry? Where did you pick that up? [00:14:23] MDS: That's what I really wanted to major in. I just fell in love in chemistry even before I took it. (Laughs) And when I did, why, it was just what I wanted. JK: Which high school and college did you go to? [00:14:42] MDS: St. Mary. JK: You went to St. Mary here. MDS: What is the University of St. Mary now was St. Mary College is where I got my bachelor's degree. JK: And where did you go to high school? [00:14:53] MDS: In Parsons, Kansas. JK: Oh, ok. Ok. So, you must have had good teachers along the way. MDS: Pardon. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 7 of 19 JK: You must have had good teachers along the way. [00:15:06] MDS: I did have some very good teachers. JK: And were they Sisters or not? [00:15:10] MDS: No. I was in a public high school. JK: Oh, you were in public high school. MDS: Uh-huh. JK: Ok. MDS: And we did have good teachers, and we did have good discipline. JK: Oh, that's good. Yes. MDS: But I always had an attraction for foreign language. I just didn't have room to get it into the schedule, you know. So, I was happy when I was able to take German here, and that was because I was looking at medical technology. German would have been a requirement. JK: Did you ever consider being a doctor as opposed to…? MDS: Oh, yes. I did. That's what I really wanted to do. My mother convinced me that no one would ever have any faith in a woman doctor. JK: Oh. That's sad. MDS: So, we dropped that and went to med tech. That was… (Laughs) JK: Oh, ok. But it was true in those days. [00:16:05] MDS: In those days she was right. She would be surprised if she knew what there were today. JK: Right. Right. You also taught German. MDS: Yes. JK: And, as we discussed before the interview you're reviewing it now on your iPad. [00:16:28] MDS: I'm reviewing, yes. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 8 of 19 JK: You also said you had four chances to speak it. Can you tell about learning it and the chances you had to speak it? [00:16:40] MDS: It wasn't so much a chance to speak as to teach. What was available at the time I taught German you could get the tapes that went with the textbook. And so the students got native speakers on those. JK: Oh, that's good. MDS: And that was a big help because I hadn't had much conversation, and so I could concentrate on the other part and then use the tapes for conversation. JK: So, can you tell me about studying German on your iPad? [00:17:26] MDS: About what? JK: About studying German on your iPad. Do they have…? MDS: Oh, it isn't German. It's Russian I have on the iPad. JK: Oh, it's Russian. MDS: My German, I just brought along a text book to review with, but I found out that I know almost as much now as I knew then. I think it just sort of soaked in during the years. So, I enjoy both. JK: And have you picked up the Russian alphabet? [00:17:57] MDS: Yes. The Russian alphabet isn't as much an obstacle as people think it is. It looks terrible but actually it isn't that bad. I mean you could learn that pretty quickly. There are some things about the Russian language that are even easier than some others. For instance, there are no definite or indefinite articles. I mean no "a," "an," or "the." JK: Really. MDS: You just say, "John doctor." I mean you say, "Ivan doctor." And then you just fill in Ivan is a doctor. So, there are several things that are easier. There are some that are harder. Every noun has six endings. That's kind of hard. JK: That is. MDS: Yes, six endings depending upon the case. Therefore, you never worry about word order. You can use any word order because if that ending means its stated case and so, you know. But �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 9 of 19 that is kind of an obstacle to learn six endings. And then there are only two conjugations of verbs. The first one's easy; the second one's messy. It has a lot of, what's the word I want, where you change the rules a little bit. I can't think of it. JK: Flexibility. MDS: What? JK: Flexibility? [00:19:36] MDS: No, not flexibility. Exceptions. JK: Oh exceptions. Oh, ok. MDS: Like English has lots of them, you know. JK: Right. MDS: That second conjugation has lots of exceptions. JK: Oh, does it? Irregular. MDS: Yes. JK: Irregular verbs. Yes. In the '70s you served on the SCL Personnel Board… MDS: Yes. JK: …as its secondary education representative. [00:20:07] MDS: Yes. JK: What did you do in that role? [00:20:10] MDS: The Personnel Board was sort of an experiment where the people in each section, like secondary ed., elementary ed., voted on a representative. But the thing I found I didn't really… We didn't have just what we were supposed to be doing definitely laid out, and it was because it was an experiment, and so I felt a little at ease (verbatim) not knowing just what I was supposed to be doing. And then because it was a voted thing. There were people who would rather have had somebody else, and that always made it a little difficult. But we got through it. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 10 of 19 JK: Oh, I see. Have you ever served as a chapter representative? [00:21:07] MDS: Yes, I did. JK: Oh, you did. MDS: One year we had a two-year session of the chapter and I did serve on that one. It was a good experience. JK: What kind of issues did you face? Do you remember? [00:21:23] MDS: We worked on problems of the community and where we were headed. We had different groups and I chose to work on the spirituality one. There was one on governance. I don't remember what the third one was. But it was for the future of the community, where we wanted to go and how we were going to get there. (Laughs) JK: When did you do that about? [00:21:52] MDS: Oh, goodness. I know I was in Topeka at that time so it must have been quite a little while ago. Let's just leave it at that. JK: Ok. Ok. So, it was prior to the time… Were there still a lot of young women entering the community? [00:22:24] MDS: Quite a few, yes. Quite a few. JK: Yes. So, you had other issues. In 1979 you went into school administration. You became principal of Sacred Heart in Fall City, Nebraska. How was your experience as principal and did you miss teaching or were you teaching also? [00:22:39] MDS: Well, I was doing both. (Laughter) MDS: It was a small high school, very small. JK: Ok. MDS: So, yes, I usually taught what you would consider a half schedule. And the principalship wasn't too much of a job because it was a very small school. They didn't have everything, you know, that big schools have. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 11 of 19 But administration is not my favorite thing. It's all right if I'm not the top man on the totem pole but… Now, in Topeka that was a larger high school, and we had kind of an administrative board. And each one of us, the four of us, I think… The principal was a priest, and then we had one who took care of activities. I had curriculum, so I did the master schedule and all the scheduling, and I loved doing that. That was mathematical, you know. (Laughs) And then I taught there also and some really good students in Topeka. JK: Oh, really. MDS: Uh-huh. JK: Do you have any memories of particular students or particular classes? [00:24:04] MDS: What's that? JK: I said do you have any memories of certain students or classes? [00:24:09] MDS: Oh, yes. Yes, I do. And, believe it or not, since I've been back here retired, I've had several come to visit me. JK: Oh, you have. MDS: Yes, from way back. JK: Really. MDS: From Topeka and from North Kansas City. JK: Oh, that's great. MDS: And then one from Hogan High School which is in Kansas City. That's rewarding. Teachers don't have day-to-day rewards, you know, and it's so nice when students come back and say your fourth year math class got me through Creighton or whatever it was. Things like that. JK: Oh, that's very nice. You live here now, don't you? MDS: I do. I live in Ross Hall. JK: Yes. Can you describe your experience teaching at St. Mary's? [00:25:03] MDS: At the college? �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 12 of 19 JK: Yes. MDS: You know there's not an awful lot of difference between a college freshman and a high school senior. That isn't that I had all freshman, but I really didn't feel like it was that much different. There was difference in scheduling. We had night courses. Things like that. But on the whole I didn't really find it… Well, there was this difference. In high school you have more time in the classroom and less time preparing. In college it's just the reverse. You spend more time preparing and less time in the classroom. JK: Right. MDS: So, that was a difference but not a hard one to do. If the class was there to be taught you put in the time getting ready for it, so your day turned out about the same. JK: Which did you enjoy more, college or high school? [00:26:07] MDS: I think high school. JK: Really. MDS: I think I did. But I had more time in high school than I had at the college too. So, I don't know. I think the kids that age I really liked. I really, really felt at home with them. JK: Why? What did you like about them? Because a lot of people are not so fond of teenagers. [00:26:38] MDS: Here's one example from… This one was at St. Pius X in North Kansas City. On April Fools' Day, or before it, the kids had planned that at a certain signal in this one class they were going to all put on dark glasses. Someone tipped me off, and so I put my dark glasses in my pocket. We were still in the habit then. And I recognized the signal and so I turned around while they put on theirs and then I turned around and faced them with my dark glasses. JK: (Laughs) MDS: And they were the kind of people that you could enjoy. They were just really good students and I could enjoy them. And other little things like that came up and I could just enjoy them. JK: That's wonderful. You're probably—I think you are—the most senior Sister that we're interviewing this week. MDS: I think I am. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 13 of 19 JK: I think you are. By the way you don't look 95. MDS: Well, that's nice. JK: No, you look like you're in your seventies. MDS: Well, people have told me that but… JK: So, you joined in 1940. MDS: I did. JK: So, that's a long time ago. And you've seen a lot of changes in training ministries… MDS: Oh, my. JK: …community culture and changes brought about by Vatican II. What are some of the changes that you've experienced before and after Vatican II brought on by Vatican II? [00:28:24] MDS: When they first started, when the changes first started, I wasn't one to get out in the front lines on any of those things. For instance, like the change in the habit. I would have been happy just to stay like we were. But it was moving along, and it was kind of a tension time in our community because there were those who wanted to and then there were ones who didn't want to change. And then just gradually some of our other customs were mitigated. You know, we were in bed at nine o'clock and things like that. So many of those little rules were changed, and I thought for the good. JK: The old rule was that everybody went to bed at nine o'clock. MDS: Pardon me. JK: The old rule was that everyone went to bed at nine o'clock. [00:29:18] MDS: They did in the schools anyway—the ones that taught. And we had 60-some odd grade schools at that time and nine high schools, so that would be a lot of people who went to bed at nine o'clock. JK: Yes. I wonder how they got all their work done. MDS: In fact, I had to get special permission the year before I took my orals at Notre Dame to stay up 'til 9:15 so that I could review. (Laughs) JK: Oh, my heavens. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 14 of 19 MDS: And, you know, those things like that just gradually disappeared, and, in my opinion, the Sisters are happier now than I've ever seen them. JK: I can imagine. What were some of the other changes that were welcome to you? [00:30:04] MDS: Being able to go home to see your parents. I only lived… Parsons, Kansas isn't that far from here, and I didn't get to go home for 11 years. I was in 11 years before… Well, see, that all gradually changed. And I got to go lots of times after that. JK: Right. I can understand why some parents were reluctant to send their daughters off. MDS: Yes. Right. (Laughs) JK: They'll never see them again practically. [00:30:47] MDS: Yes, that's right. That didn't mean I didn't see them. They could come visit me. JK: Oh, they could come visit you. MDS: They could visit me. I just couldn't go back to my own home. And, as I say, we only lived 130 miles, so. JK: That's awful. Did any of the changes require some adjustment for you? [00:31:09] MDS: Oh, I think so. Yes. But they came gradually. So, I'll tell you one of the biggest adjustments for me was the music in church. And now, of course, I think it's great. I mean there is so much better music now. But some of the first attempts I thought were pretty bad. I love classical music and so what they were turning up with… I almost walked out one day. (Laughter) MDS: But gradually that got better. The good musicians got in on it and the church music hymns got a lot better. Now I think they're wonderful. JK: Oh, good. Good. So, you're involved in a prayer ministry now. Can you tell us about that? [00:32:05] MDS: I don't know really what you mean by that because it wasn't a ministry in the sense of going out and working with other people. It was just my own spiritual life. JK: Right. Right. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 15 of 19 MDS: I had time, you know with... But for one thing I broke my ankle, no, my leg once while I was in Topeka, I think. Well, wherever I was and I had to come to the Mother House to recuperate because our house halls were too narrow for a wheel chair. No, I believe it was when I was in Grand Junction, Colorado. That's when it was. And I had time then to pray and to think, and I think my own spiritual life developed at that time. And there were some people that I did influence. If you talk about a ministry I didn't really set it up as a prayer ministry but there were some people that I was close to that we had conversations about prayer and different types of prayer and so on. But some people have that prayer ministry as really their job, you know. JK: Right. So, it's an individual thing for you. [00:33:33] MDS: That's right and the few people that I influenced by the fact that they were my friends. JK: Well, the SCL community does so much active work but prayer plays a role also. So, can you say a little bit about how prayer reflects on the community and on yourself? [00:34:00] MDS: How prayer reflects on the community. JK: Yes. MDS: I think our community has always been very prayerful. But I think one of the things that was important to me, because I was at a point in my earlier life when I was very dissatisfied with my own prayer life, and we had just very limited books that we could use and then gradually it got so that we could choose our own, you know, and things like that. And that was a big step forward for me. But finally over a period of, maybe, six years, more than that, I got into what's called Centering Prayer. And that was really worked out by three Trappist priests. They saw a more contemplative type of prayer being… There were people that really desired that type of prayer, and they were running off to India and Japan and China to find those things, and these three Trappists said we have that in our own. We just have to find a way to make it available to people and not just religious, to all, anybody who wanted it. So, they worked out this little plan with four steps to it. And then they started experimenting with it, and I happened to make a retreat here by one of the ones on that group, and he just threw it out as an experiment. But it resonated with me. It was kind of what I was looking for. And he didn't call it Centering Prayer then. It was just this method. But, you know, that in 35 years that it's been going it is now in 50 countries. In other words, it has just taken hold like everything. And it's for everybody—Catholic, Protestant, anybody that wants to, you know. It's not limited to any race or religion or anything. So, it has just spread like wildfire. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 16 of 19 And so they have an organization. They call it Contemplative Outreach. And they have headquarters in most cities, and it's just grown and I've grown with it. JK: Well. That's interesting. MDS: I mean it has really been what I needed. JK: Have other people taken it up here? MDS: Oh, yes. (Laughs) JK: Oh, really. MDS: Oh, yes. If it has spread to 50 countries there have to be a lot of people there. But in our own it's… One of our Sisters was head of the group in Denver. And if you could see their publication you would see where it is. Father Thomas Keating is sort of the head one there and he has written numerous books. I mean there's plenty that people could read on it. But it has spread very, very rapidly. JK: That's interesting. When did you retire? [00:37:31] MDS: Let's see. Oh, I retired from the college after 12 years, and then I still wasn't ready just to sit down. So, I looked around and one day our table up where I was living… I was living in Mead Hall. We had a group of six Sisters living together there, and that was another new thing— to get away from this large community living and into smaller groups. A lot of people really wanted that. And there was a list of some openings at the Marillac Clinic in Grand Junction, Colorado. And I looked at the four and I knew three were not in my realm of being able to do. So, one of them was bookkeeper. I had never taken a business course but numbers, you know. JK: Right. MDS: I thought I surely could add, subtract, multiply and divide. So, I interviewed for it and took it. So, I spent 16 years in Grand Junction, Colorado working at the Marian Clinic… Marillac Clinic for people who had no insurance or very little insurance. And besides doing bookkeeping I did a lot of other things too. And I loved those 16 years. I wouldn't give those up for anything and it's from there then that I retired. JK: And when was that? [00:39:17] MDS: Oh, let's see. Let's see. I've been here two years, so the 16 years before the two years I was here. JK: Oh, ok. Ok. So, you retired a couple of years ago then. [00: 39:39] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 17 of 19 MDS: Yes. JK: Yes. MDS: I didn't work full-time at Marillac in Grand Junction. I really worked a half schedule. JK: Oh, ok. Well, that's good. MDS: Because I was getting on, but that was a wonderful. Loved Grand Junction. The people are wonderful there. And it was just a very good experience. JK: How did you feel about retiring and coming back here? [00:40:06] MDS: By the time that I did retire and came back here I was ready to because I knew that I needed more help to live and medical help and I knew it was time. I hated to leave Grand Junction but I really knew I needed to. And, of course, this is a wonderful place. Ross Hall wasn't finished when I came but I've grown with it, so. (Laughs) JK: Oh, good, good. So, it hasn't… MDS: So, I'm very happy. JK: It hasn't been too difficult a transition. [00:40:50] MDS: No, it really hasn't, not as hard as it's been for some people, I think. The Sister I was living with in Grand Junction, it's very hard for her. She had been there for a long time and had lots of friends. And it was very hard for her. JK: Yes. Since you were working in healthcare as a bookkeeper, but, nonetheless, you were surrounded by others working in healthcare… MDS: Yes. JK: …what do you think of what's going on in Washington right now with the healthcare legislation? You're rolling your eyes. (Laugh) [00:41:27] MDS: That's all I can do. I almost stopped listening to it. I just get so upset. It isn't worth it. (Laughs) I can't imagine how the American people put that man in office, but they did. JK: Hard to realize. Hard to understand. [00:41:50] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 18 of 19 MDS: It is. I'm sure some of them regret it. (Inaudible) to. But I don't know where we're headed in healthcare or… But if that bill of his goes through all kinds of poor people are going to lose their healthcare. Medicaid is going to go down the road. JK: Yes. And so people will die. MDS: That's right. JK: Because of (inaudible). [00:42:16] MDS: At Marillac Clinic we had Medicaid for our dental. The rest of it was all medical, and we had a wonderful program for mental health where a person could see a medical provider and a mental health provider on the same visit. And those were all poor people. Travel wasn't easy for them, you know. So, that was a great boon for them. Today they have, the clinic has, competed for a grant of some kind. I don't understand all the details. But anyway, they got it. They've received it. And right now they have doubled the number of people they were seeing before. It's flourishing. JK: Oh, good. MDS: That makes me happy. JK: Well, it's a short-term benefit anyway. [00:43:10] MDS: Yes. JK: Yes. MDS: So, that was an important part of my life, those 16 years in Grand Junction. JK: It must have been. Would you like to add anything to what we've talked about? [00:43:30] MDS: I don't know. I think you pretty well covered it. JK: Oh, I have one more question. MDS: All right. JK: What do you see as the future of SCL? MDS: Of…? �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Mary Denise Sternizke Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 28, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, September 4, 2017 Page 19 of 19 JK: SCL, the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth. [00:43:44] MDS: Well, we're surely not getting a lot of new members but neither are most of the other communities. It's because lay people can do a lot more things, I think, than they used to. They didn't have to join a religious community to do them. And I don't know what the future of SCL is except that the spirit is so wonderful. When I came home I thought I would find Sisters sitting in rocking chairs waiting to die. That is not the case. I mean these people are just doing all kinds of things in Leavenworth and in Kansas City. They're active. It was just a wonderful revelation. I can't see how something like that is going to die out. JK: Oh, thank you. That's a wonderful perception. [00:44:30] MDS: I think some way or other God's going to find us a way to continue, but I don't know how. JK: Others have said the same thing. In one way or another things will… the community will continue. ### � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Sternitzke, S. Mary Denise Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Kenamore, Jane Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data MPEG Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 45:06:00 Location The location of the interview Digital Sisters Files Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Sternitzke, S. Mary Denise, Oral History, 6/28/2017 Subject The topic of the resource Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth, Teaching, School Administration, College Teaching Description An account of the resource She speaks warmly of her family. Her father was overjoyed when she joined the Community. Her mother had reservations, but grew to be very proud of her daughter's call to religious life. Initially, Sister taught in elementary schools and struggled with this age group. As she speaks of her transition to high school students, you can hear her voice change. She loved working with these students and inspiring them to overcome their fear of math and science. Her stories illustrate a lifelong commitment to educating herself. As math and science research progressed, she did graduate work in mathematics, chemistry, and physics in order to better teach these subjects. She talks about her love of languages. She studied German earlier in life, and in retirement, she was tackling Russian on her iPad. Other topics include her transition to school administration, college teaching, and Leadership positions as Secondary Education Representative on the Personnel Board and a Chapter representative. Sister also spends a good deal of time speaking about her relationship to prayer throughout her life. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Sternitzke, S. Mary Denise; Kenamore, Jane Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 6/28/2017 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource All rights belong to the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Sternitzke, S. Mary Denise Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1922-2017 Education Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/ad8f06015b467be463a9885813c1dfdd.jpg a735053e8606c2a7c064fd9468d2f3ee Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Sisters of Charity of New York Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Bullock, Angelica Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Sugrue, Noreen, SC Location The location of the interview The New Jewish Home, Kittay Senior Apartments, Bronx, New York Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data audio/mp3 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 28:52:00 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Sugrue, Sister Noreen, SC Oral History Subject The topic of the resource Sugrue, Sister Noreen, SC Description An account of the resource Sr. Noreen Sugrue has shared her reative skills as a teacher, artist and Congregation archivist. She taught elementary grades, spirituality to novices, and art to students of all ages, including one summer in Appalachia and ten summers at the New York Foundling. From 1973-1986 as the Assistant Archivist for the Congregation, she chose a new archives storage location and designed the building space, managed the artifacts in the Elizabeth Seton Museum, and arranged and described the historic materials. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Sugrue, Noreen, SC Bullock, Angelica Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Sisters of Charity of New York Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2019-05-06 Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Mindy Gordon (Transcriber, Editor) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Permission for reproduction or quotation must be obtained through written application to: Director of Archives, Sisters of Charity of New York, 6301 Riverdale Avenue, Bronx, New York, 10471. This permission is valid only insofar as the Archives of the Sisters of Charity of New York, as owner or custodian, has any rights in the matter and does not remove the responsibility of the author, editor, and publisher to guard against the infringement of any rights; including copyright, that may be held by others. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/wav application/pdf Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Sugrue, Noreen, SC Oral History Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant New York City https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/a2f9521faeae8d6edff5002daa0d4e59.jpg 633d62d78b9e85d0940bc24f5c524bdc https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/80c884d8321070fd4b18ac46e9dd10b4.mp3 bcf879a0b2324744218cac952bb522a1 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/f7e44eb863425cb0825d2b723f458067.pdf d886fb5d81b32f8c938a8c7396b3ed7b PDF Text Text SISTER CYRILLA VERHALEN [Excerpt] BIOGRAPHY INTERVIEW BY SISTER JOSEPHINE TARQUINI JANUARY 21, 1988 Sr. Cyrilla: Today is the very day that I left the Seminary to go out to San Francisco. Sr. Josephine: And when was that Sister? Sr. Cyrilla: It was the Feast of St. Agnes, and it was during that dreadful year when everybody was having the flu [The 1918 Spanish Flu Pandemic]. Sr. Josephine: 1918? Sr. Cyrilla: 1918. And it was the funeral day of that dear Sister who came from California [possibly Sister Agnes McEleney]. She was the biggest, the strongest, the healthiest looking Sister, and from the very beginning the doctor said, “No earthly power can save her.” So she died, and she was being buried on her name day but in the general, big cemetery [Calvary Cemetery], because they didn't have any cemetery yet at the Marillac. Sr. Josephine: Sister, you are not exactly sweet sixteen. When were you born? Sr. Cyrilla: I was born in 1894. Sr. Josephine: And what was your birthday? Sr. Cyrilla: The third of August. Sr. Josephine: The third of August 1894. When that date comes around, you'll be how old then? Sr. Cyrilla: I'll be 94 years old. Sr. Josephine: Ninety-four. Isn’t that wonderful. [Jump in excerpt of recording] Sr. Josephine: You entered at the Marillac, Sister? Sr. Cyrilla: Yes. Sr. Josephine: Who was the Visitatrix then? [Sister] Eugenia Fealy? Sr. Cyrilla: That was her. 1 �Sr. Josephine: And who was your Directress? Sr. Cyrilla: I have to think of her name. She was the first Directress of the whole Province. Sr. Josephine: Was that [Sister] Madeleine Morris? Sr. Cyrilla: She had a brother who was a bishop. Sr. Josephine: That was Sr. Madeleine Morris, and then she went over to France and was a Secretary [Sr. Madeleine became General Secretary for the English-speaking provinces in 1945]. Sr. Cyrilla: She really knew French so well that she could translate it right through and just read French. Sr. Josephine: What did you think of the Seminary? Sr. Cyrilla: Sister, I was too sick to think of anything. Do you know what I had when I was three weeks right after Thanksgiving while I was at St. Anne's [Asylum] a postulant? I got sick and was having a high fever, and it lasted for three weeks, and the doctors didn't know what was-- What is it? What’s the matter? What am I getting? And jaundice! Yellow jaundice. And Sister, imagine getting out of bed of yellow jaundice and going to the Seminary and then handfuls of chocolate. [Portion redacted from transcript] Sr. Josephine: Well, then you got the habit Sr. Cyrilla: And we were stuck there with the flu, the terrible flu, and they kept us there. This is a funny thing Sister. We were kept over so that we wouldn't get the flu. Sr. Josephine: And, of course, you got it? Sr. Cyrilla: And you know how we got it? The Sister sacristan, not knowing how dangerous it was, went to visit the man that scrubbed the floors. Had the flu. She brought it home, and all these young, new Sisters who had received the habit were helping in the chapel, and we all got it. On Christmas Day, one after the other got sick, and so the doctor said, “Sister, take the temperature of all of them.” I was a goner, because I knew I had a terrible night. I didn’t want to go to bed on Christmas. Sr. Josephine: When you got over the flu, then you went out on mission, where did you go? Sr. Cyrilla: To Sister Caroline. 2 �Sr. Josephine: In San Francisco. Sr. Cyrilla: St. Vincent's School or the St. Patrick's Parish [Her first mission was St. Vincent’s High School]. Sr. Josephine: And how long were you there? Sr. Cyrilla: I was there until 1932 I think it was. 3 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Daughters of Charity, Province of St. Louise Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Tarquini, Sister Josephine, D.C. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Verhalen, Sister Cyrilla, D.C. Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data Cassette Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:04:31 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Verhalen, Sr. Cyrilla, D.C. Oral History (Excerpt) Subject The topic of the resource Verhalen, Sr. Cyrilla, D.C.; Daughters of Charity of St. Vincent de Paul; Influenza Epidemic, 1918-1919 Description An account of the resource Sister Cyrilla Verhalen discusses her time in the Seminary of the Daughters of Charity and her first mission in Perryville, Missouri during the outbreak of the Spanish flu in 1918 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Verhalen, Sr. Cyrilla, D.C.; Tarquini, Sr. Josephine, D.C. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Daughters of Charity Archives, Province of St. Louise, Emmitsburg, MD Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1/21/1988 Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Keefer, Scott (Editor) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Permission for any type of publication of archival materials, including text, photographs, video, or audio must be secured from the Daughters of Charity Communications Director before publication.ÿ Contact archvies staff for appropriate forms and contact information Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio/mp3; Application/pdf Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Verhalen, Sister Cyrilla Oral History Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1918 Daughters of Charity of St. Vincent de Paul Healthcare Religious Formation https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/c451095b12c34c0d739e9aff43766581.PNG 63d5aaa7c8578b2a8d125975d2265ff3 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/d199c7267cab54d043fb8ed3bd637062.mp3 2778fa24fadc2a01e3cc88f885a68726 https://www.scfederationarchives.org/files/original/4663826f45a5d9dd7e9594f54fd14f4f.pdf 1a88b5dc977211dadf417c258a68aedb PDF Text Text Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 1 of 17 JK: This interview is with Sister Susan Wood. The interviewer is Jane Kenamore. We're at the Mother House of the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth in Leavenworth, Kansas, and the date is June 30th, 2017. Sister Susan, to get things started when and where were you born? SW: I was born on May 8th, 1947 in Washington, D.C. JK: And were you raised in Washington, D.C.? [00:00:37] SW: Oh, not at all. My father was a student at Georgetown at the time, so it was a very temporary stay for the family. I actually grew up in the Kansas City area from about the age of four. JK: Ok. And can you tell us about your parents? What was your father doing at Georgetown? SW: My father was going to Georgetown after World War II on the G.I. Bill. He was in the School of Foreign Service although he never did anything in foreign service. He ended up being a general manager for Standard Motor Products which sold ignitions and things like that for cars. My mother was a nurse from Owatonna, Minnesota. My father was from Altoona, Pennsylvania. They met in San Francisco and were married out there. And I was born in D.C. and grew up in Kansas City. JK: Ok. (Laughs) And did you attend parochial school in Kansas City? [00:01:41] SW: I attended St. Ann's in Prairie Village—the Sisters of Charity took it over at some point there—through the fifth grade. And then my brothers—I have two brothers—and we were in public school for three years which for me was grades sixth, seventh and eighth. And then I went to Miege High School, Bishop Miege High School in Shawnee, Kansas for high school. JK: Did you have as many kids in your class as the Sisters talk about? [00:02:12] SW: Well, in the fifth grade in St. Ann's in Prairie Village there were 52 in my classroom and 42 were fourth graders and the rest of us were fifth graders. JK: And taught by one person, right? [00:02:29] SW: Taught by one person. Sister Jean Carmel. JK: And how was it from your perspective? I haven't asked anybody how it was from the student's perspective. [00:02:40] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 2 of 17 SW: There was a big change for me between fifth grade and sixth grade because sixth grade I was in a public school and it was much smaller, and I had a very innovative teacher in the sixth grade, Mr. Diemer. They ended up naming a school after him when he died, and he was the one that taught me that I could be a student and kind of encouraged reading and creativity. St. Ann's was very regimented. I think it had to be to have that many students in the classroom. So, it didn't do me a lot of favors personally to be in that environment. And so it was much better for me to go to the public school and have that sixth grade experience. I didn't care for Junior High very much when I went there, and it was more comfortable in the Catholic high school when we switched over to that. JK: And the classes were smaller in the Catholic high school? [00:03:35] SW: I don't know if they were smaller but it was a familiar environment, and it was very college prep. And it was '61 to '65 that I was in high school. That was the Sputnik era. And so I had four years of math and four years of science. JK: Really. SW: Uh-huh. So, it was a very good education at that time. JK: Yes. And did he SCLs teach in the grade school that you attended? [00:04:09] SW: Part of the time. When I first went to St. Ann's it was the Ursulines of Paola, Kansas, and then at some point, and I don't know what year, the Sisters of Charity took over. And then the Ursulines had the high school that I went to. JK: Ok. You joined SCL right after your freshman year… SW: Of college. JK: …at St. Mary's. Right? [00:04:37] SW: Yes. JK: When did you begin thinking about entering a religious order or looking at a religious order? [00:04:45] SW: Probably in high school. JK: And what attracted you to the idea of women religious? [00:04:52] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 3 of 17 SW: Again, you have to put things in their historical context, and at that time if you were a woman and wanted to work in the church that was the obvious route to take. JK: In terms of leadership and…? [00:05:12] SW: Yes, but you know the feminist movement hadn't quite happened at that particular point in time. I mean what is interesting is that the Second Vatican Council ended in 1965 which was the year I graduated from high school, and so I entered right on the cusp of the Council. And it's interesting in terms of my history in community because I've lived through every conceivable change in community, because I was in the long habit for nine months as a novice. I never had the white cap that the professed Sisters wore, but by the time we made first profession we were in shorter skirts that were made out of the old habit. So, I went through the regime of the community which was traditional but it was changing when I was in formation. In fact, they didn't quite know what to do with people in formation. They didn't know what we were being formed for in a sense at that time. And so, I usually say, well, I've been there and I've done that, and I don't want to do it again. JK: So, how was it? Can you describe the formation period and some of the changes that were taking place at the time? [00:06:42] SW: One of the changes that had happened in the community shortly before I entered is that we started saying the Liturgy of the Hours for morning and evening prayer. Before that time it had been a prayer book full of novenas and short prayers. And so that was one of the things that happened before I entered. And it was as a result of the Second Vatican Council because the Council had recommended that we use that as the liturgical prayer of the Church. But I don't think it was ever in our bones as a community in the way it was for Benedictines who had always done that. So, that was one change. We had two kinds of silence, ordinary silence and sacred silence. Sacred silence was at night and between 2:00 and 3:00 in the afternoon here at the Mother House. Ordinary silence was you could talk to do your business but you didn't chatter. There were formal times for recreation. That was part of it. So, in some ways it was very much on a monastic model. And actually the reason for that is that there was a 1917 Code of Canon Law… You're getting this from a theologian. JK: Good. That's what I was looking for. [00:08:07] SW: There was a 1917 Code of Canon Law which tended to put all religious communities in the same mold, and it didn't differentiate between the different charisms of the community. And so they all looked alike, you know. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 4 of 17 Mother Xavier didn't start out wearing a veil. She wore a veil towards the end of her life because the Sisters wanted it because they wanted to look like other Sisters. But when we took it off it was actually returning to how we were originally, because the first Sisters wore prairie bonnets, if you’ve seen other pictures of Sisters of Charity. We were founded not to be monastic. St. Vincent de Paul said your cloister are the city streets and the rosary is your breviary in a sense. So, when the Second Vatican Council told communities to go back to the charism of their foundresses, communities like Benedictines, who were supposed to be monastic, retrieved that and started calling their convents monasteries again, you know like their Mother Houses. And then communities like mine said that we're not monastic. That isn't who we are and so that prompted the change in life at that time. So, things have changed a lot, and it's going back to whatever those original charisms were of the community. We're still doing that today. JK: You're still going back? [00:09:55] SW: Going back to… So, like we've retrieved our Vincentian charism. I think I wrote in and said… You know, I celebrated my jubilee last year and one of the comments I made in the thing I wrote was that when I entered, yes, we were Vincentian. We kind of knew what that was, but it wasn't at the forefront of consciousness in the same way as it is today. Whereas we're having a big community meeting in the next couple of days and we're looking at critical needs, and those critical needs tend to be social needs in society and looking at how we can respond to them. That's very Vincentian in a way. So, that's what happened. JK: You spent your early years teaching French and English in high school. How did you enjoy that? Was there anything that you didn't love about it? [00:11:00] SW: I was never meant to be a high school teacher, I would say. I did it for six years. The French I still use today 'cause I use it in research, 'cause I'm a theologian today. And I have never stopped teaching English to my students because I make them write. So, those are skills that have never been lost. But early on I knew I was more destined to be a college teacher. JK: So, when did you become interested in theology and how? [00:11:36] SW: Oh, there's a story behind that. JK: Oh, good. SW: (Laughs) 1973 I was making my first directed retreat here at the Mother House. And directed retreats are these things that the Jesuits did, and individually directed retreats were rather new in 1973. And they tended to march people through the spiritual exercises over eight days, and they were somewhat regimented. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 5 of 17 And I remember that one day I had this very… I say I don't have religious experiences but sometimes I have clear, discreet ideas. And I had this clear, discreet idea that I wanted to do theology, and I wanted to do with my mouth what some people do with their lives. And so I went into the retreat director and said, "I have this thought that I want to do theology." And he said, "That's a distraction. Put it aside." And so I thought I don't have to talk to you about this. But I was teaching high school in Topeka, Kansas at the time, Hayden High School, and so I went back and decided to do what I could, so I volunteered for the religious activities committee which planned the retreats and different liturgical functions for the high school and soon became director of that. And the Father Thomas Santo (phonetic) was principal of the school at the time, and he decided to go into fulltime administration and asked me if I would teach his religion classes. So, I picked up sophomore liturgy and morality and that's when I stopped teaching English at the time. [00:13:32] And then the community had this thing where you filled out a piece of paper every year. And so every year I'd put what I really want to do is teach theology. I was not released to study theology until 1981, so for eight years I kept asking to study theology. And finally there was no one else in the community who could have done it or would do it. And then they let me. And that was because you had to have a foreign language ability to do a PhD in theology and I had the French. And also at that time it meant that you were teaching at St. Mary College in Leavenworth Kansas, and some people didn't want to do that for the rest of their lives. Well, I didn't obviously because I taught at St. Mary for ten years. Four of those were French. Six of them were in theology after my PhD. And then I went onto St. John's in Collegeville where I taught for 13 years for the Benedictines. And then I've been at Marquette with the Jesuits now starting my thirteenth year. So, it all kind of worked out in the end but it took me eight years to kind of get going with it. JK: Why do you think it took eight years? [00:15:00] SW: I don't think the president of the college wanted me to do that. When I walked out the door she said you could do what you wanted to do better if you were in English. Although at the time the plan had been that I would get a PhD in French. But I'm glad I didn't because the bottom fell out of French studies. The last thing I did before I left St. Mary was to turn a major into a minor and very few people are studying that even at Marquette today. So, theology was much the better field for me to be in in the long run. So, that was it. I don't really know. JK: You mentioned the comment by the Jesuit in 1973. I mean although we think of the '70s as being a time of equality for women because the Women's Movement started in '69 but obviously that was not the case. Or do you think it was gender related? [00:16:18] �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 6 of 17 SW: I don't think it was gender related. The other odd thing about 1973 is that was probably in June and I went off that summer to start my master's in French at Middlebury College. So, I had this conviction that I needed to study theology and went off in this other direction for this degree in French because at that point… I think early on in the community we tended to think of people filling slots in a way. And Sister Mary Vincentine was somebody in the community who had PhD in French with a master's in theology interestingly enough. And I was supposed to replace her. That was the thinking. That never happened but what's funny is I became the mirror image in some ways because I have a master's in French and the PhD in theology which was just kind of a reverse of what she did. Other than that we're very, very different. So, I think that was part of the thinking for a while, and so, I can't really say. But people left the community who had been earmarked to study theology. There was somebody in my novitiate class who they thought would succeed Sister Mary Jude who was teaching theology. And that person left the community. There were some people in Kansas City that they thought might do it but they didn't want to teach college. They were in pastoral work or they didn't have the language background. So, I mean I just had to stand in line. JK: Yes. Have there been any challenges. I mean theology is or was at least a male-dominated field, wasn't it? [00:18:29] SW: It still is. I'm in systematic theology. Some women tend to go into spirituality or they tend to go into pastoral theology. And if you're at a research institution like I am I would say… I looked it up and I think about… In research institutions that don't have these pastoral degrees the number of women tends to be about 25 percent. Now Marquette, we've been less than that for whatever reason. But I would say it still is. JK: Still is. SW: Uh-huh. Some areas of theology more than others. JK: Has that proved to be a problem for you or not? [00:19:22] SW: No. JK: Other than annoyances. SW: It isn't a problem. I mean the other thing is, you know, I'm enormously involved in ecumenical work, and I have four official appointments, two of them international. Well, three if you count the North American Orthodox, the International Commission for Baptists and Roman Catholics, and the International Commission for Lutherans and Roman Catholics and then the U.S. Dialogue, Lutherans and Catholics. And the Orthodox dialogue, I'm the only woman on the �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 7 of 17 Catholic side. There are two women appointed on the Orthodox side and there are at least 20 people sitting around the table. So, that shows that. And in terms of the U.S. Lutheran Catholic Dialogue, I'm the only woman appointment on the Catholic team. On the international dialogue there are two of us on the Catholic team. The Catholic Church tends to be gender-blind in terms of when they make these appointments they're not trying to balance anything. You know you're balanced for your expertise. Lutherans on the other hand have a quota system and the quota system is both gender and also region of the world that they come from or represent. And so, you know, on that side it's different. I have two brothers. They're twins to each other, two years younger than myself, and I say that they prepared me for the rest of my life. [00:21:03] JK: (Laughs) SW: When I left St. Mary College, I left St. Mary College, because I wanted to be a theologian. I wanted to write and publishing was not an emphasis here nor did we have the library to support it. And so that was making waves at the time because people didn't really… It was unusual to get a job outside of our own institutions. But I went and asked if I could look for another job and Sister Kathleen Stefani, who was community director at the time, said yes. I didn't want to discuss it. She didn't for some magic reason. And so I was in this job search for two years and St. John's moved very quickly and I went there. And that was a male environment because it was a school run by a male community of Benedictines who were walking around in these habits, and I thought oh, my gosh. What is this going to be like? But it ended up to an enormously nurturing environment for me and I loved it. And I didn't leave it because I didn't love it when I went to Marquette 13 years later. But it worked out really well. So, I do think there are issues with women in the church very definitely and also in academia and I think sometimes we have to be better in order to compete. But I've managed to do it, I guess, and hold my own. JK: Congratulations on that. It's very good. Can you tell us about St. John's and how are they nurturing? [00:23:15] SW: When I went I didn't know what was going to happen. I didn't know. Things weren't working out here and somebody had said, well, just get off dead center and try something. And so, here's the story. So, I was the new kid on the block and I had an eight o'clock class, because of course those are the last to fill up. And I would arrive at school about 7:15 in order to teach an eight o'clock class because you can't walk into a classroom cold. And Columba Stewart, one of the monks who was �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 8 of 17 in my department finally, figured that out or figured out that I was coming then. And he said if you're going to come at 7:15 why don't you come at 7:00 and pray with us? [00:24:16] I had never been in a choir stall in my entire life up to that point because we're not monastic. And so they had a guest section in the choir so I started coming to Morning Prayer. For several months I had this most amazing experience of, I think you'd call it, fight, flight and attraction. I was like a moth attracted to a flame and I wanted to come closer, and at the same time I wanted to run away as fast as I could. And this went on from October until January the 8th, no, December the 8th of that year. Well, December the 8th is the Feast of the Immaculate Conception. And I was in the choir stall and I was up on the last rung and the monks are amazing because they really do feast days up really good. And so for this feast day they had hung votive candle lights from the ceiling or something and it was beautiful. But I remember looking over the choir stalls at everybody who was assembled, 'cause it was not unusual for guests to pray with us 'cause we had a school of theology there and so a lot of the students would come. And I remember just thinking to myself you don't know it yet but I belong here. And that sense, all that flight, attraction tension totally disappeared. And I ended up taking to it like a duck to water. I mean it was just the most amazing experience, and I loved it. And for the rest of my 13 years there I prayed Morning Prayer with them Monday through Friday at 7:00. And so they became a community and I was kind of an insider/outsider. I was an outsider because I was a woman. I was an outsider because I was a Sister of Charity of Leavenworth. I was apostolic and they were monastic. [00:26:52] Some of the Benedictines do marvelous things. Like there was a women's community about five or six miles down the road that we were in a partnership with as a school. And their prioresses would officiate at the funerals for their Sisters. Then I would come home here to Leavenworth and I'd start saying wouldn't it be a good idea if… and I would get just to the "if," not even the idea and somebody… the immediate response was but we're not monastic. In other words, they didn't even want to hear it, whatever it was. And so, here I was a Vincentian, an apostolic religious, a Sister of Charity that took to this Benedictine environment like you wouldn't believe and yet I never really wanted to be a Benedictine. I mean I could not do with my life today what I'm doing if I were a Benedictine because I would have a vow of stability and I'd have a different relationship to community life than I have now. But I was so attracted to their spirituality. And, in fact, for the first three years I was there—I was trying to figure it out—what does it mean for a Sister of Charity to be in this Benedictine environment? And there's a Benedictine up the road here in Acheson, Sister Irene Knoll, who would come and adjunct occasionally, and I was talking to her about this one day. And she clarified it in a way. She said the charisms of different religious communities, they're attracted to different parts of the Scriptures and that �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 9 of 17 becomes kind of emblematic for who they are. And for apostolic religious it tends to be the Gospel. So, for us it's Matthew 25, you know, "Whatever you do for the least of these you do to me." For Benedictines it's the Wisdom Literature. [00:29:00] And so I was involved with the St. John's Bible project from its inception at St. John's. I was on the Committee for Illumination and Text for years until we finished it which meant we wrote the theological briefs for the artist, Donald, who was the scribe. And early on we were talking about which passages would be illuminated and with what weight. And I was saying there's this passage in Sirach you have to illuminate because you pray this text for Morning Prayer on the Feast of St. Benedict. And they said, we do? You know they didn't even recognize it. I mean they recognized it but they… It was just so much a part of their life, you know. So, what it meant to be an outsider was in a way to reflect some things back to them that maybe they weren't able to see. And there were a few times I was able to speak to the community about sharing their charism. And I have good friends there, so they mean a lot to me. JK: Friends from when you were at St. John's? [00:30:20] SW: When I taught there. JK: Oh, interesting. SW: In fact, I'm going back August 2nd to the 8th this summer. JK: Oh, really. Just for a visit. SW: To visit. JK: How was your first experience as head of the Theology Department at Marquette? [00:30:45] SW: I was the first woman to ever be the chair of the department. I'm still the only woman who has been chair of that department. So, I don't think of myself as a pioneer, but I guess in some ways I have been. It's a challenge. When I was chair the first time around we had 32 members in the department, so it's a big department. JK: And are priests most of the other members of the department? [00:31:28] SW: No, no. They're a minority. JK: Oh, ok. SW: It's mostly lay people. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 10 of 17 JK: Ok. SW: Mostly men. JK: (Laughs) SW: It just is. Being chair is really hard. The personnel issues are the hardest. I think the higher you go up the academic ladder the bigger the egos become, so you're dealing with a lot of big egos. And so I think personnel issues are probably the hardest. JK: What types of personnel issues? [00:32:09] SW: I don't think I want to go into it. JK: Oh, ok. Yes, right. You mentioned in your bio as this (inaudible) asking you about everything you've written that your writings focus on the issues of ministry, sacramental theology, ecclesiology, and ecumenism. So, how did you become interested in these four topics first of all? [00:32:43] SW: Ministry was another one of these clear, discreet ideas that I sometimes have. I don't have a lot of them, but the ones I've had have been life changing or formative. And that one was one evening at 10:00 P.M. in 1988. I can't remember the date. I was in St. Louis at the time, and my dean who was Carol Hines here at St. Mary College at the time… People should watch me when I'm ready for a sabbatical 'cause I tend to jump ship at those junctures. But I had missed a sabbatical when I went off for PhD studies, so she said that she would fund a summer of research if I came up with a project. So, St. Louis is actually, probably the closest major theological library to Leavenworth at St. Louis University. So, I was in a residence there. And I had a project which I actually never, ever did. But I had to do two things that summer. One was to write a response to the Decree on Ecumenism for its 25th anniversary after Vatican II. And then the other thing was to do this other project, but we were having a big community meeting, and I had to come back to Leavenworth in the middle of it for that. So, at ten o'clock on this particular night I was putting the period on the first piece which was the Response to the Decree on Ecumenism, and it sounds strange but I had a clear, discreet idea of what a bishop was. And it was the concept that he represented the Church in the Communion of Churches and there was a parallel between the College of Bishops and the Communion of Churches which right now is a commonplace idea. But at that moment it was original for me and to me. So, then I went off to Leavenworth for a week and played around and went to a wedding and came back to St. Louis. And I was faced with a decision and that was do I keep my original �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 11 of 17 research project or do I go off in this new direction, which was totally different. And so I gave myself three days to snoop around the library and I basically tried to see what was out there. And so I made the decision to change the topic of my research and I decided to do the research on bishops. So, my studies on ministry didn't start with priesthood. It started with the episcopacy and worked down from there. And I wrote for four weeks. I mean I did this in four weeks, and I eventually published that article in Theological Studies which is one of our top journals. And so that basic concept about the representative function of a bishop I worked data for the next ten years in various ways. So it became programmatic for the work I was doing, the research I was doing while I was at St. John's. JK: So, what were your conclusions? [00:36:40] SW: That the bishop represents the Church and the Communion of Bishops and the Communion of Churches. And so what's different about a priest and a bishop isn't about power, but it's about this symbolic, representational function. And then, eventually, I wrote on the priesthood. I was going to do the diaconate and then I became chair of the department and I never kind of got there. So I've never done that study. I've gone off in other directions since. But that was how I got into ministry. Now ecumenism is basically that if a door opens I walk through it. And so, two things. I went to St. John's in Collegeville in 1992 and on my desk was a letter from Carl Braaten, who's a Lutheran, inviting me to a dogmatics colloquium that he was having in Northfield, Minnesota. And he and Robert Jenson, who's another kind of famous Lutheran theologian… Robert Jenson was teaching at St. Olaf's College in Northfield at that time. It was a group of younger scholars, many of whom had graduated from Yale. Many of whom were not Catholic, and we would meet in his basement and they'd put a table cloth over the ping pong table. That was our conference table. And we would sit there and we would write papers and have these theological discussions. [00:38:34] And there's something about Yale. They come out speaking their own language. And it was a foreign language to me. And again I was frequently one of very few women. Mostly these were guys. And the hot air would just go across that table like you wouldn't believe. And I would sit there thinking, Susan, you're smart. You should know what they're saying. And I knew what each individual word was and I had no idea why they were saying what they were saying or what they were saying. I mean you know it was just a lot of verbiage. But I stuck it out and eventually coedited a Festschrift for Carl Braaten and became good friends with him and Robert Jenson. But that was my first… My theological education in school had been almost exclusively Catholic. I'd read maybe Moltmann or some other authors. But it was pretty Catholic and my background was really Catholic and so this was an introduction to other thought. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 12 of 17 And then at the same time Jeff Gros was a Christian Brother who was on the staff of the Secretariat for Ecumenical and Religious Affairs at the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. And he was looking for ecclesiologist to staff dialogues. So, the first thing was I was invited to a meeting in West Palm Beach, Florida. And ecumenism at that time was kind of at a turning point because the dialogues had gone over most of the major issues, and they really didn't know what do we do next. And at that meeting I remember getting very excited by and very convinced by the notion of what's called Communion Ecclesiology and became vocally supportive of it. [00:40:59] Then I was appointed to a two-year commission of Lutherans and Roman Catholics, and we were just called the Joint Commission. And we were given two tasks. One was to review the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification for our churches. And the other one was to come up with a topic for the next U.S. Lutheran Catholic Round. I was the one who developed the topic and it was on communion ecclesiology and the structures and ministries of the Church seen through that lens. And it became round ten of that dialogue. And then, of course, if that's going to happen, then I was appointed to the dialogue to carry it out because it was basically my idea. And so I've been involved in Lutheran-Catholic conversations since 1994 which is when that commission began. [00:41:56] And then in 2005 Brian Daley who was the co-secretary of the North American Orthodox Dialogue invited me to be on that dialogue. And then about 2008, I think, I was appointed to the International Lutheran Dialogue because our topic is baptism and growth in communion and one of my books is Baptism and the Ecumenical Implications of the Doctrine of Baptism. I mean it's called One Baptism, the Ecumenical Implications of the Doctrine of Baptism. So, I'm sure that had to do with why I was appointed there. And so I've kind of been a major ecumenical figure… JK: Sounds like it. SW: … through all this. But, again, they invite you and you say yes. JK: And then you take the lead. Yes, yes. Interesting. [00:43:00] SW: It gets kind of technical, so I hope I'm not getting too technical here. JK: It does but thanks. Those are simple explanations. I appreciate it. So, we talked a bit about Vatican II—how did the changes brought on by Vatican II change your religious life? [00:43:26] SW: Yes, we did. JK: Ok. So, you've been distant from SCL geographically for some time. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 13 of 17 SW: Twenty-five years. JK: Yes, a long time. How has the community helped you nonetheless? Or has it? [00:43:52] SW: Sounds strange. They give me the rope to do what I need to do. They're very supportive. In some ways I think that if I would have had to have stayed here I wouldn't have been in the community today, 'cause I wouldn't have thrived. So, things are a little different now. I'm on the governance committee which is this new committee. We just had a General Chapter last summer. So, I'm on the governance committee and the committee appointed me as its chair. So, I absolutely love Sister Connie Phelps who's our community director. I'm so happy that we have her. But she's pulled me in from the margins. (Laughter) SW: She taught at the college. She taught sociology at the college for years, and she's just very important to me. And for a long time… I mean I never considered myself a fair-haired child of the community. I never considered myself one of the popular people for whatever reason. I just always seemed a little different in some ways. What I do is not the norm. We're not academics. We’re teachers. We don't write books. We don't write articles. I have 70 articles and five books. We don't do that. And so I'm sure that's part of the reason I have felt marginalized and I've been able to be part of the community because I'm at a distance in some ways. I mean it's kind of strange. I have friends in community. I have good friends, but they're all over the country. My friends don't tend to be geographically close to me. I have ecumenical friends that are everywhere and my good friends in the community they're here or they're in Montana. But when Connie became community director I said, "Let me know if I can help you." And she said, "Don't worry. I'm going to call on you." And so she put me on this committee, and we're in charge of this event in two days. And so, I don't need another thing to do. I mean I have a job and a half, 'cause all the ecumenical work is in addition to my day job. So, she's pulling me in from the margins. [00:46:56] But the other thing that is really strange is that when I… I celebrated my 50th Jubilee last summer. And when I talk about these years with you I mean they seem like yesterday, you know. But when I entered we were just under a thousand Sisters, and now we're slightly over 200, 200 and, I don't 'know what we are, 15 maybe. Somewhere in there. And so we're downstairs. Just before I came in here we were moving tables for the meeting and 114 Sisters are going to be active participants of this meeting and then we have some observers. And the committee, we had a meeting at 1:30 today and we said next year when we do this there will not be 114 because of where the demographics are. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 14 of 17 So, in my lifetime we were at a point where we were wondering whether we should divide into provinces because we were so big, but they could never figure out how to cut up the pie and keep the schools and the hospitals in some kind of cohesive unity. And it's good that we never divided into provinces because we'd be combining them today. JK: That's right. [00:48:24] SW: But it is kind of scary to think about the diminishment. We do have some fabulous younger Sisters. And some communities haven't had anybody enter in 20 years. I mean we have wonderful, talented, younger Sisters. But the future's not going to be where it is today. JK: What is the future? I mean would you ever consider admitting men for example or bringing associates closer to the community. I don't know. Are there other ways of looking at the future of SCL? [00:49:15] SW: Men, no. JK: (Laughs) SW: Sorry. JK: (Laughs) SW: Associates, I think, they're very different. It's a very different model. Whether you would have some people who have more temporary commitments versus a lifetime commitment, I don't know. If you look at the history of religious life I think of Thomas Merton The Seven Storey Mountain. Thomas Merton entered his community… He became a Trappist in 1947, 1948, somewhere along in there, I think. I hope that's right. Anyway, after World War II there was a huge influx into religious communities. And I think the kind of despair that war leads to sometimes causes people to look at religion in a way they haven't before. But the sociologists tell us that that was a blip on the historical screen and that the norm has been smaller communities. And religious Sisters are really responsible for the healthcare system in this country. But that's being taken over, such as it's surviving these days, by secular entities and the same thing with school systems. So, we're moving away from those institutions, but I still think there's a care for serving those who are in need. And so that will look different. I think communities will be smaller. I think in the near future collaboration with other communities. I certainly hope we don't have to meld with another community anytime soon. I personally am not looking forward to that and certainly in terms of joining them and their works and working together. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 15 of 17 JK: I see. Can you talk a little bit about the new structure that's exemplified by the meeting on Sunday and Monday? [00:51:49] SW: Ok. At our last Chapter we voted in a new governance structure. It doesn't change anything in our constitutions. It doesn't change anything in terms of the General Council and the community director. But we had been experimenting with something called Leaven Groups. Of course it's a play on Leavenworth. JK: (Laughs) SW: We get our money's worth where we are. I sometimes think of that game where you say it's smaller than a house and larger than a breadbox. A Leaven Group is larger than a local community and smaller than a region. And most of them are six to eight people. And it's to get kind of a sense of community because more Sisters are living alone and in very small groups. It's kind of a grassroots kind of structure where it's supposed to be participatory. We do contemplative dialogue. We start with faith sharing, so it has that kind of a basis. But it's a place for issues to be raised at the grassroots level and then kind of trickle up rather than everything be down. And then there's supposed to be continuity between Leaven Groups and the Annual Assembly. Now that we're as small as we are it's feasible for us to come back once a year and have this assembly. So, this is the first one of that. So, there's supposed to be an interchange between those Leaven Groups and the assembly. [00:53:33] I'm affiliated with a Leaven Group in Helena, Montana. So, we meet twice a year. We meet from 9:00 in the morning 'til 3:00 in the afternoon. When I see that the Kansas City and the Leavenworth groups meet for an hour twice a year, you know, I shake my head and say how can they possibly do that? Even in Montana they have to travel from Missoula or Hamilton to Helena, and I'm flying in from Milwaukee. We're going to make that quality time in a way that local people don't. And maybe we have a bigger need for that. So, we have a fabulous group out there. And I enjoy it immensely. And it's my primary community really. JK: So, what are some of the issues that you will be discussing if you can talk about that? [00:54:37] SW: Ok. One of the things that the Leaven Groups did in their two previous meetings was to surface critical needs and so there are five critical needs that we've identified. One is immigration, refugees. One is limited access to healthcare. One is human trafficking. One is care for creation and the environment. And one is spiritual hunger. And so those are the five areas that we're going to be looking at. But, as I said to the group you can't start just meeting needs. You have to assess the needs. You have to assess your resources. You have to assess in a local situation what needs to be done. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 16 of 17 So, we're having two panels as part of this day, these two days. The first panel will be people who've been involved in assessing needs. We'll talk about that process. So, Sister Vickie Perkins is going to be talking about Welcome Central which is an organization here in Leavenworth that they worked together with the leaders of various churches to see what the needs of the City of Leavenworth are and they've come up with this Welcome Central. [00:55:57] Our Peruvian Sisters are going to talk about their assessment in Piura, Peru which led to the St. Vincent Pastoral Center there. And then we have a layman, Casey Dunning, who's related to our Sister Marie Carmel Dunning—she's 98 years old—who's coming here to talk about the Interfaith Cooperative in Missoula, Montana. So, they'll be talking about this process of assessment. And then we'll have a panel in the afternoon where we have Sisters who are actually working with immigration, care of creation and so forth. And then we have doctor who's the head of the clinic in Topeka. So, they will be examples of people who are already involved in those critical areas. And then the Sisters will see what bubbles up and to see if there is some kind of response that we feel called to beyond those individuals. So, that's where we're going. [00:57:04] At the Chapter we also developed a directional statement. So the mandate for the Leaven Assemblies and the Leaven Groups is to unpack that statement. And one of the statements in that directional statement was to address critical needs and their systemic causes. So, that's what we're doing. JK: Oh that really sounds interesting. Well, thank you very much. SW: You're welcome. JK: Do you have anything else you'd like to add? [00:57:39] SW: I don't know. It's just that I feel a vocation to be a theologian and that's become clear and this is the context in which I do that. It's amazing. It does not seem like 51 years now. JK: You've got a huge amount of work as chair of the department, teaching, research and then your spare time SCL stuff. [00:58:20] SW: It's full. JK: It's very full, but I can tell that you love it. [58:27] SW: I do. JK: Yes, yes. So, thank you again. SW: Oh, you're welcome. �Sisters of Charity, Leavenworth, Kansas Transcription of Sister Susan Wood Interviewed by Jane Kenamore, June 30, 2017 Transcribed by Jessie Lehman, October 1, 2017 Page 17 of 17 ### � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Wood, S. Susan Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Kenamore, Jane Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data MPEG Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 58:52:00 Location The location of the interview Digital Sisters Files Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Wood, S. Susan, Oral History, 6/30/2017 Subject The topic of the resource Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth; Teaching; Theology; Vatican II; Charism Description An account of the resource Susan begins with what it was like coming to the Community just post-Vatican II. She discusses the changes of Vatican II from a personal as well as a theologian's point of view. She talks about beginning her missions in the Community as a teacher but not finding she was strong at it. She then speaks of having her epiphany that she wanted to work in theology and her path to get there. She also talks about feeling connections to charisms from other Communities as she works and finding deeper meaning in the Community through that. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Wood, S. Susan; Kenamore, Jane Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 6/30/2017 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource All rights belong to the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Wood, S. Susan; Kenamore, Jane Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1947-2017 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Audios Education Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth